56 KHK valves and springs

Production K Models

Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby panic » Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:42 pm

I suspect that's American Cycle Fabrication (Paul Friebus)
[url="http://victorylibrary.com/L-BK.htm"]The Linkert Book[/url]
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby 55panman » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:14 pm

Yeah, If that's who the seller is, he runs some kick ass Flatheads. I've seen his stuff at Bonneville and it's impressive!
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby wz507 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:07 pm

Using the values provided in the Harley Shop Dope bulletin cited earlier in this topic .... viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1004 .......the spring rate of the 18200-32 spring calculates out to ~ 195 lb/in using the stated free-length, seat and open forces.

An alternative performance spring offered by American Cycle Fabrication (ACF) has a rate of ~ 300 lb/in, which is acknowledged by ACF as they specifically state “These are a direct bolt in for K Model and are 50% improvement over stock”. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Harley-Flathea ... 1742802673 Thus, the ACF spring would provide considerably higher seat and open force than the stock 18200-32 spring.

A similar performance valve spring available from Enfield Racing has a slightly lower rate of ~ 270 lb/in.

See page 13 of the Enfield Racing parts catalog. http://lindendocs.s3.amazonaws.com/enfieldracingcatalog020216(1).pdf
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby EKHKHK56 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:40 pm

Bill, I just called you recently about the frame you asked about, so never is not always. This K deal is a hobby. I'm trying to get on my feet, lost my shop last winter, lost an eye 3 months ago, Im totally unorganized and have no real income so all my efforts are just trying to keep this home Im renting. Have one big truck head job Ive been on between rain and ebay sales keeping me busy. Anyone can reach me again at 907 456 1561. Shop phone back on, same number since '79. If I dont answer please leave a message. Im trying to complete orders but I have not gotton any parts organizing done, 10% maybe, so I dont know where parts are yet. I have been recovering from old, new, injuries, neck, both shoulders reinjured during falls moving shop to my back yard for 45 days last winter. Next month I may have vision back, more operations. That would help me a lot. Right now trying to sell and do some jobs to make it, and behind on everything. Fun getting old...Erik
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby EKHKHK56 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:49 pm

An old racer told me way back, use the lightest valve springs you can get away with. Less friction, less wear and tear. Radical springs are reserved for high rpm, interference type valvetrain, race only, tear down and inspect and go again. Not really needed to keep a K going down the road. Remember some 100 year old engines use atmospheric pressure to operate valves. No spring or super light. Just some thoughts on this...
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby wb56 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:13 pm

I saw the springs on fleabay that cyclemosmotorclothes and American cycle sell, both high performance springs. Niether list them as a replacement for 18200-32. Enfield won't sell just their springs, you have to buy the kit. I wanted to steer clear of any high performance parts. I'm not building a racing bike just a bike to ride on the street. Like you said an old racer once told you Erik "use the lightest valve springs you can get away with. Less friction, less wear and tear." You helped me in the past Erik so thanks for your help again. Didn't mean any ill will about phone calls, I didn't know your shop phone was not hooked up. Thanks to all the other folks who gave support. The outcome will be that I have a KH that I"m going to disassemble and use the springs in it. I"ll use the new replacement springs in the KH.
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby 55panman » Thu Sep 19, 2019 1:02 am

Interesting articles the last 2 months on valve springs in Hot Rod magazine. Billy Godbold, Comp. Cams main spring GURU, said the same thing about lightest springs. There is a guy I know, a tool and die engineer, who CNC copied my KR J cams to run in a couple of 45's they're racing, who sourced a set of Beehive spring from PAC to run in their 45's with the J cams. He says they work great. I'll try to find some info on them.
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby wz507 » Thu Sep 19, 2019 7:19 am

55panman wrote:There is a guy I know, a tool and die engineer, who CNC copied my KR J cams to run in a couple of 45's they're racing, who sourced a set of Beehive spring from PAC to run in their 45's with the J cams. He says they work great. I'll try to find some info on them.

If the PAC springs were fit in the std small dia valve covers, then they were likely a PAC-1233 (300 lb/in rate) or a PAC-1234X (240 lb/in rate) spring, as very few of PACs beehive springs have a small enough large end dia to fit in a K Model/45 valve cover. Given the dimensions of these springs, they require special length stools to achieve appropriate seat and open force. If the 1233 and the 1234X were used with 0.395” lift KR cams, at full lift they would add 119 lb or 95 lb respectively to the seat pressure.

It will be interesting to hear what spring he chose for his application.

PAC 1233 specs.jpg
PAC 1233 specs.jpg (27.37 KiB) Viewed 3452 times

PAC-1234X specs.jpg
PAC-1234X specs.jpg (23.56 KiB) Viewed 3452 times
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Re: 56 KHK valves and springs

Postby 55panman » Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:04 pm

Hi, my buddy told me he uses the 1233 PAC spring for his WR and WL converted to WR engines, running J or F cams that he makes. Copies or the KR cams without the angle on the lobe. He has to make new spring covers like the KR spring covers for these because of the larger diameter. He said he originally tried the amer. cycle fab springs in an engine and broke one of those spring. He said they were crap. He then used the cyclemos springs and didn't have any trouble with those and they were a better spring. He has an engine or 2 still running those springs and they race them hard. This guy builds great flathead engines so I'd trust his word.
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